Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Two Dogs, Pirate on December 7, 2013 at 7:45

Steve I don't know of another state that would be like Louisiana. Someone may correct me if I am wrong but I think that all of the lower 48 states, except Louisiana and maybe one other look at minerals as being a separate thing. It is my understanding that the Napoleonic Code, which Louisiana law is originally based doesn't recognize a situation where someone could own something for ever. Maybe one of our Louisiana attorney members could be a bit more helpful than I in explaining this. I would advise being careful in the thought of changing laws where cases could end up in the US Supreme Court, you may find yourself with the fed gov owning all minerals in the USA.

Permalink Reply by Andrew on December 13, 2013 at 15:04

There are a half-dozen or more states other than LA that have adopted "lapse statutes" or "dormant mineral acts" that cause unused mineral rights to revert to the surface owner(examples: Indiana, North Dakota, Michigan).

2 things make Louisiana unique among these states.

The first is that LA places a far heavier burden on those hoping to maintain their rights: LA mineral owners can 1) drill a dry hole, 2) actually produce minerals, or 3) get the present landowner to give them more time. The heaviest burden imposed by other states is typically filing an "I still want to keep this" affidavit in the land records every 10-20 years (e.g. North Dakota) or paying property taxes if the minerals are producing (e.g. Ohio; also common sense: if you don't pay your property taxes, you lose your property).

The second is that Louisiana's property system is unique due to our Civil Law heritage, and so mineral rights in LA are governed by LA property law, with LA terminology. As TDP correctly points out, a major difference from the other common law states is that LA property does not permit perpetual or future fractioning of property rights (I.e. we have no "present estates" or "future interests"). In LA, all property has an OWNER (or co-owners), and rights carved from ownership, which rights absolutely must be used to be maintained. This is why a mineral right (or a right of way across your neighbor's property) that is not used for 10 years ceases to exist.

Though LA's unique property laws are more ancient, they serve the same purposes as more recent US Dormant Mineral Acts: to prevent land/resources from sitting idle when they could be put to productive use, to provide stability and clarity to land titles, and to prevent the accumulation by a wealthy few of the state's land/resources without any cost of ownership. This is part of Louisiana's legal tradition, but it is also very much a modern policy choice by our state: minerals should belong to Louisiana's landowners, not the successors of a handful of timber companies that were lucky enough to own lots of land at the turn of the century. This is a more populist approach than most states, but that's nothing new for Louisiana.

Permalink Reply by mark edward marchiafava on December 7, 2013 at 8:02

Many years ago, I went to the LSU law library, searched the oldest records of the legislature of the territory of the FRENCH territory of Louisiana, dated 1803.  I discovered the FRENCH territory of Louisiana adopted the common law of England.

Fast forward to the first session of the State of Louisiana's legislature.  In 1812, it proclaimed it would adopt all laws, rules, customs and practices in effect at that time, unless specifically repealed by statute.

Permalink Reply by Andrew on December 13, 2013 at 14:26

Mark,

The LA Purchase Treaty and subsequent governmental acts maintained the "status quo" of the legal systems that were in place at the time of the purchase in 1803, which in Louisiana (as we know it today, Territory of Orleans back then) was the Civil Law of Europe. At the time of the purchase, the Code Napoleon was over a year away from enactment, and there was no real "code" or compilation yet. European civil law was made up of countless different sources dating all the way back to Ancient Rome. This body of law was called "ius commune" ('droit commun' in French, 'derecho comun' in Spanish), which literally means "common law," but was much different from the "common law" of England.

Shortly after the Treaty was signed, Louisiana's first Governor (William Claiborne) issued the Proclamation of December 10, 1803 in English, Spanish, and French, where he stated that "all laws and municipal regulations" in force on the date of the Treaty would remain in force until changed by local legislators. Once today's Louisiana was first made into a territory separate from whole purchase territory, the first official act of the territorial legislature in 1806 was to say the same, and to actually list European civil law sources as being part of LA's law.

PS: I'm glad to hear someone else is using the LA historical documents archives!

Permalink Reply by mark edward marchiafava on December 13, 2013 at 15:31

I was paraphrasing, as I didn't copy what I read word for word. After decades, the old memory starts to slip. Thanks for polishing up my post for me.

Permalink Reply by Andrew on December 14, 2013 at 14:24

Mark,

I certainly didn't mean to correct you, and I thought your observation was on point. Those old state records are fascinating to me, and I was glad to hear someone else had taken a look at them.

Permalink Reply by mark edward marchiafava on December 14, 2013 at 14:35

thank you for backing up my ancient memory from the late 70's. When you get this old, you need all the backup you can get.The memory banks aren't quite as clear as they once were. The book was printed by Clairborne Press out of New Orleans, the left side of each page was English, the right side was printed in French !  The books dated early 1800's, Clairborne Press is still in business today, I believe.

Permalink Reply by onesock73 on January 12, 2014 at 7:41

Our lease is ending this fall, October I think. We are in a permitted unit but haven't heard plans of drilling it soon. 

Do you think we will get the lease extended or they will make a push to drill. We have 250 mineral acres in the lease.

Permalink Reply by Rock Man on January 12, 2014 at 8:08

A lot of factors will go into that decision. The cost of exrtensions versus drilling a $13-$15 MM well may make the former the most prudent financial move right now.

Permalink Reply by Joe Rollins on February 26, 2014 at 9:35

Looks like HK has their Gaulden pad almost finished.

Permalink Reply by Charles Bell on February 26, 2014 at 10:21

Thanks for the report, Hopeful. That would be located as following: Sect 36,37,49 T1N R1E

Can you see it on a daily basis? If so, please keep us updated. thanks

Permalink Reply by Joe Rollins on February 26, 2014 at 12:39

Not daily but I will keep an eye out

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