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Permalink Reply by mike smith on June 19, 2009 at 11:25

If you were a Chrysler or GM dealer who just lost his franchise do you think a workable plan could be selling vehicles which have been converted to CNG. Seems like I heard there was some sort of tax incentive and if not there should be, and the home compressor stations are available for purchase and installation. I bet there are lots of prospects for .50 a gallon fueled cars with a ready source of fuel. Seems to me the car and installed compressor could be sold as a package.

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Permalink Reply by Mac Davis on June 19, 2009 at 16:36

I can't see NG vehicles ever catching on with the general public unless you can use gasoline somehow in a pinch. Who wants a vehicle that you can't drive to another town because there aren't any NG fueling stations along the route you're driving? Are most of the proposed NG vehicles dual-fuel, or single fuel?

Also, what member of the general public is going to buy an NG vehicle if the NG fueling station fad may vanish in the future? I remember a push on NG fueling stations about 10 years ago with lots of fanfare, but the few stations that got built disappeared a few years later.

Some people might consider an NG-only car for around town use, and a gasoline car for longer trips, but then you get screwed having to buy liability insurance twice, even if you only have one driver.

I wonder how long a fillup takes if you pull up to a corner gas station NG fueling station.

$6000 for a home filling station? GMAFB!

I also wonder what happens after there are a few spectacular fires from NG vehicles or fueling stations. Never mind that gasoline cars and fueling stations explode too, we're talking the news media and politicians looking for publicity. Outright bans, required monthly inspections, having to have a guy walk around in front of you with a red flag, etc.

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Permalink Reply by jffree1 on June 19, 2009 at 18:18

My former employer has been using Propane fueled forklifts for decades. It takes about 5 minutes to fuel one up (smaller tank than a car of course). Never an accident in my ten year history with them except for a valve leak on the storage tank once. So I would not have any problem driving a CNG vehicle if I could get someone to sell the gas around here and I'm a fifty-something female. I live in rural E. Tx. so having the gas piped to the house is not an option unless I get a well in the back pasture.

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Permalink Reply by Mac Davis on June 19, 2009 at 20:29

Butane and propane storage tanks have a considerable portion of the fuel stored as a liquid. If a leak develops, the liquid has to boil to turn into gas, and that will take some time, because it will get cold and the pressure will drop.

A CNG tank will be higher pressure, and won't have to boil, so it has the potential to come out much faster. NG is lighter than air.

I'm not sure how all this adds up in terms of explosion/fire danger, but CNG will probably have considerably different hazards than gasoline, propane, or butane.

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Permalink Reply by Mac Davis on June 20, 2009 at 9:53

I think you misunderstand my comment. I'm not saying one or the other is necessarily better or worse, just that they'll probably behave considerably differently.

The fact that butane and propane have been used as vehicle fuels doesn't necessarily give you a good feeling for how dangerous CNG will be, or mean we know how to handle CNG in vehicles well.

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Permalink Reply by Bobi Carr ("parker") on June 20, 2009 at 10:26

I am not in the least mechanical, so CNG would have to do a good job with Public Relations in order to over come fears, whether those fears are rational or not.

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Permalink Reply by Mac Davis on June 20, 2009 at 16:47

We're funny about risk in this country. If CNG storage in vehicles is 25% as dangerous as gasoline storage in vehicles, anyone producing CNG vehicles will probably be sued out of existence.

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Permalink Reply by sesport on June 20, 2009 at 18:22

Mac - I'm not so sure that people will view it as riskier to have ng for a vehicle fuel, especailly younger consumers. (The older ones may struggle as they usually do with anything new.)

Nat. gas is already used in homes for stoves/ovens, water heaters, fireplaces, etc. It may be viewed as just an extension of using a product they're already familiar with, especially if there is availability of refueling stations. A station dedicated to ng won't be necessary, either. Maybe 1 or 2 pumps like we now have for diesel.

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Permalink Reply by Jon Williamson on June 20, 2009 at 16:04

I think most of the conversions will burn gasoline as well as CNG. Anyone who talks this down surely owns a refinery or loves filling Arabs pockets with US $.

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