Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Les Bamburg on November 1, 2008 at 7:02

KB, you can bet the farm on the major oil & gas companies (Big Gas) taking a bigger position in unconventional gas plays including shale gas. Shell, BP, ConocoPhillips & ExxonMobil already have positions in the Rockies and San Juan Basin. Some (BP & Shell) are in shale gas and ExxonMobil recently bid on acreage in the Marcellus Shale play.

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Permalink Reply by Grice on November 1, 2008 at 7:07

But, from a speculative position, are they indulging in shale gas for direct profit purposes? Those same companies have been investing in renewable energy for years. What better way to enhance their position, than to "regulate" the alternatives.

Permalink Reply by Les Bamburg on November 1, 2008 at 7:14

KB, absolutely to develop shale gas and other natural gas plays.

Permalink Reply by Les Bamburg on November 1, 2008 at 10:18

KB, the money behind clean coal includes Peabody, Southern Companies and Edison among others since they have a lot at stake with the coal industry. By the way I have a book "Big Coal" on my shelf. Of course I have The Prize and The Last Boom also.

US gasoline demand could be cut by 25% and it would have limited impact on the profits of major US oil & gas companies. Several of these majors are spending large research dollars on biodiesel and gas to liquids technology.

Permalink Reply by sesport on November 1, 2008 at 9:02

The idea of energy independence has been promised for 35 years.

Now as Barack Obama and John McCain vie to become the next president, a promise of U.S. energy independence again has become a rallying cry on the campaign trail.

Is it possible, or even desirable? Many energy experts say it's not. People disagree on what energy independence means — zero energy imports, or something less? And even if the United States were energy independent, would it be insulated from global oil price shocks, with oil priced in a global marketplace? Again, energy experts say don't count on it. from AP, Josef Hebert, Oct 31,2008

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Permalink Reply by Snake Stewart on November 1, 2008 at 17:17

Sorry KB . You know I luv ya but there are at least one or two Dems talkin nationalizing the refineries. When that happens there wont be any stopping there.Now that the economy and the government are in such a fix, it is looking pretty harsh for us O&G tycoons down here in Louisiana.

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Permalink Reply by Snake Stewart on November 2, 2008 at 3:27

I certainly hope and pray that you are right and I am wrong on this one KB . Only time will tell us that.
The honorable senator from Texas is one of those that are very outspoken about it. I aint baitin' but the more He and his people speak of being stingy or unpatriotic about giving more, it scares the bejeezies out of me. There is a clip on this board somewhere showing one of her speeches about it.

Come Tuesday we may begin to see who the real "Hustler" is I am afraid.

P.S. That Nationalized Security thing's not real kosher either. I know, I know, The whole Blackwater whatever you call it thing reeks , but at least most of that stuff happens where you dont have to see it. There have been and will continue to be many things happen that we as a people probably dont need to know about.Plausable deniability.We arent tough enough as a nation anymore.

Mr. "O" doesn't feel the need to hide or explain away anything that puts him in a bad light or should embarrass him. That in itself should petrify us all !

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Permalink Reply by sesport on November 1, 2008 at 18:21

Re. Fortress Management thread ... the person that started it may have deleted it, for whatever reason.

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Permalink Reply by The ShaleRider on November 2, 2008 at 5:24

This blog started as the question for the nobrainer movement to NG and how to do it. I also strongly believe that it is a nobrainer.

While a few good suggestions have been offered, it has wandered off into the positions/strategies of the politicians and the oil companies. I neither trust or foresee either one moving us into the NG direction in the "near future" as in the next 2 to 3 years. My "in a nutshell view" of the indiosyncrocies of politicians, lobbyist, and big oil...I do not bank on any of them as having OUR best interests as part of their agenda or corporate strategy.

I have spent several "spare" hours researching how to do this. Some of the information was posted on this site a month ago under "investment", but more research is needed. (Maybe I'll get back to it when work slows down again. :-0! )

Although there IS some value to local government use of NG in the fleet autos, I still do not view this as the "mass changeover" needed to effect this movement. The market for NG will only be primarily affected when US consumers make the switch.

SO I have determined to switch to NG with the next MY purchase of a "newer used car" and add on the NG fuel capabilities next March or April (when the current vehicle has ~150K miles on it). The vehicle will then be "bi-fuel" ... meaning it will still switch to gasoline for those trips >200 miles (these are fewer times than one might think). With the mileage that we are putting on our vehicle ... and the state and federal incentives that will help offset the cost, we will break even with the savings from NOT using gasoline somewhere between 2 to 4 years (depending on the fluctuations in cost of gasoline, it most likely WILL go back up after the election). The upfront conversion cost is currently a little costly for some consumers...but there is also currently very little market for the conversion. The only way to bring it down is for those who can afford the upfront cost to DO it...thus create a market for it, and this will lower the cost through the American way of supply and demand and market competition. Depending on your mileage driven and if you drive your vehicle more than 3 or 4 years, you break even and some will come out ahead as soon as 2 years. If you only drive a vehicle for 3 years or less before buying another, you can probably afford the conversion regardless.

I am not waiting for ...or trust the government OR oil companies.. to get the NG movement started. THEY may not do this for 10 years and maybe never. But CONSUMER DEMAND WILL accomplish it. We all have to decide to do it as consumers. With the Shale being right under us, we have TWO reasons to make this switch ourselves as an investment into OUR future...and do it NOW.

I am not T Boone... haven't even met him yet...don't have the ownership of the PHIL manufacturer (as he recently purchased) but still...

I approve this message.

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Permalink Reply by The ShaleRider on November 2, 2008 at 6:50

Thanks, Goshdarn,

The states of California and Utah have paved the way with NG use. Utah seems to be doing the most private owner auto conversions while California is providing large tax incentives for NG cars and NG fleet vehicles... and I have not seen where they have any appreciable NG drilling local to their states. But they are decidedly ahead of Louisiana and even Texas where drilling Barnett has been ongoing for 7-8 years.

We can all write to our governor, senators, and representatives to add to the federal and state incentives for NG here in LA. This will no doubt help the movement to NG.

But, in any case, if CA and UT can do it..so can we. The bottom line is...we the consumers need to get behind it now...nobody else looks after me/us better than me/us.

ShaleRider

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Permalink Reply by sesport on November 2, 2008 at 5:46

" ...what is the argument against it? And why is the movement being overshadowed?"

These were the questions asked in the discussion topic. I think most were trying to figure out the answer to Question #2.

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Permalink Reply by The ShaleRider on November 4, 2008 at 7:49

To address this reply...and as posted in another blog area....

Remember that the political "battle ground" states include PA, OH, WV,... and these states are coal-producing states...PA is probably the largest. The NG states of LA, TX, OK, AZ, KS are already all for McCain. BOTH candidates are trying to get the battle ground states' votes right now and they are coal states. So we are all hearing "clean coal" being pushed right now by both. When the election is over, hopefully NG can get back in the political limelight.

McCain absolutely knows about NG...his state of AZ is an NG producer ... and auto NG conversions/add-ons are already been going on in AZ.

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