Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by The_Baron on November 21, 2008 at 5:13

My first car was a Toyota. I drove it till it had 125,000 miles, got a new car when I graduated from high school, gave the Toyota to my little brother who drove it for three years.

We then sold it for a fair price.

It takes a good car to survive not just one but two teenage boy drivers.

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Permalink Reply by doublebogey on November 20, 2008 at 10:57

Be careful what you wish for.

I don't totally disagree with you about not giving the bailout but the domestics do need to get to a level playing field with the imports. The Japanese government has manipulated the value of the yen for many years to give them price advantages. We don't export to them on the same terms that they sell here. Their plants here pay $25-$30. per hour less to their workers than the domestics but the unions will bite the dust and take all down before they would agree to be competitve.

Suppose GM files for BK, can't borrow to operate, and close down. Chrysler and Ford would have to follow suit because most of the suppliers would be broke and no parts to build vehicles with. All the retirees, and I would guess that would be hundreds of thousands, would quit receiving retirement checks and benefits. The current employees would be on unemployment. The domino effect would be monumental.

It's not a simple matter

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Permalink Reply by The_Baron on November 20, 2008 at 10:59

I agree that losing the Detroit automakers would be bad.

I just don't agree with rewarding decades of poor management with our tax money.

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Permalink Reply by The_Baron on November 20, 2008 at 11:31

More importantly, the union contracts can be renegociated.

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Permalink Reply by Grice on November 21, 2008 at 5:41

(Sarcasm)
Due to the outcry of the auto industry executives continued used of private jets, and to demonstrate their commitments to environmental consciousness, they each will return on December 8th driving a Toyota Prius.
(/Sarcasm)

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Permalink Reply by The_Baron on November 21, 2008 at 6:15

I heard they were flying parcel post. lol

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Permalink Reply by Grice on November 20, 2008 at 11:32

While the first proposal was rejected, the senate officially announced today that the DAI will have the opportunity to readdress the senate hearing committee when they reconvene on December 8th. If the DAI can give details of where the money will be spent, it is likely they will get the bailout money. The DAI originally gave the impression of a group merger. Two weeks later, before the senate hearing committee, the DAI changed it to a bailout request. With that request, they offered little information about how the money will actually be spent. It is my impression that the DAI will survive this crisis, but they will not be able to play their games with our money. Upon approval of the money, the DAI will be working under a microscope. This concerns me, as it offers nothing more than another song and dance routine by the senate leaders. If the DAI were to give specifics as to where the money will be spend and then we grant them the money, what prevents them from changing where the money is actually spent after they have the money in their pockets? Sure, Mr. Brofsky (if confirmed) will watch them, file report and blow the whistle when things go astray. But, when all is said and done, if the DAI misuses the money, will the treasury sue the DAI to get the money back? I do not see that being an option. Basically, whether they provide specific details or not, they will get the bailout.

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Permalink Reply by RAY on November 20, 2008 at 18:46

I 'm sure the Big 3 & the Unions would rather "re-negoiate" than go under..........cut out all of the extras, then come back & ask for a loan.

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Permalink Reply by The_Baron on November 21, 2008 at 4:06

If congress dosn't pass the bailout next month when they reconvene, the Union may be cut out. Bankruptcy would allow GM to throw out the union contracts.

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Permalink Reply by wpt9452 on November 21, 2008 at 11:46

For the sake of argument, which I hate to argue, but aren't so many things screwed up in this country. A baseball pitcher from Japan gets 55 million dollars for a 5 year contract. He gets a house, private tutors for his children and can't speak English himself. More money is spent on professional sports players than can be imagined. Take a cancer research doctor wanting funds for curing this horrible disease and see what he can scrape up. We don't seem to mind the excessive salarys basketball, football and baseball.....ect sports figures get but we get upset when we or someone we love dies from a disease that has no cure because research funds are not there. I refuse to watch any sports just because it's obscene to see these people become filthy rich becuase they can hit a ball or throw a touchdown. GM pays me 29 bucks an hour and so many people thinks it's almost criminal. I have over 80 hours of college and have worked with people that have masters degrees but work for GM because they make twice the salary working for GM. Just remember when a doctor does your brain surgery, he does it over and over and for him it's just like building a truck or car, just doing the same thing over and over again.......like GM any monkey can do the job.

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Permalink Reply by Snake Stewart on November 21, 2008 at 14:57

Hey wpt9452 ,
Please tell me you arent compairing brain surgery to bolting seats down in a Hummer. Even tho the Hummer is more expensive I dont feel that the comparison is just.

The main problem with your Pro sports scenario is that they couldnt survive if they werent creating enough surplus money to pay their players.For the ones in weaker markets, the stronger markets have to agree to pay out the same amount of money as the others, even tho the weaker markets arent even making that much.The stronger markets get to help fund the weaker markets just to help give them someone to play down the road.Kinda like Ford having to pay someone else because the Yugo sucked.Not to mention that if its anything like China, then 1/2 of the Japanese players salary goes back home to his government.

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Permalink Reply by wpt9452 on November 21, 2008 at 17:19

Hi Snake, No, I am not comparing brain surgery with assembly line work. But I think you would agree that these procedures are probably done exactly the same way every time. I doubt there is much creativity in the operating room, or I hope not! As far as the money in professional sports goes, I will never understand the million dollar deals some of these players make but I am sure "marketing" and profits from ticket sales and television rights do create a lot of money. I remember back in the 70's I was a Dallas Cowboy fan and it seemed the players were a "team" and didn't trade back and forth for the highest dollar. Ok, like everything else money makes the rules and thats just the way life is. Now I spend most of my time worrying about our economy and how we are going to get through this. I hope for our sakes something positive happens soon.

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