Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Rosebud on June 22, 2010 at 12:38

drilltheshale,

You say you think we all have concerns for safety and the land, water, and air God gave us. That's a given but destroying the livelihood of thousands of workers, which will lead to the rigs shutdown here being moved to places like Brazil, seems more like throwing the baby out with the bath water.

All those other companies you mentioned and probably others as well pretty much did use the same emergency spill plans, except for the letterhead they were basically identical, but that doesn't speak to me too much more about their liability in all this than the porn-watching federal people who should have insisted on much more responsible and detailed plans. I can't help sharing the responsibility for a disaster plan being adequate with those who ordered the plans then probably never even read them.

I don't see why any safely operating wells should be shutdown to be inspected, etc., if federal inspectors have previously been doing their jobs with the wells operating. What's the real reason to shutdown a safely operating well with no record of problems?

My opinions are against the government moratorium for one reason in particular. Remember the seven "experts" the Obama administration engaged to recommend whether or not to have this moratorium? These people put together a detailed report and then signed-off on it. Ken Salazar THEN changed it and submitted it to Obama recommending the moratorium. The experts have been livid - they, to a man, recommended against the moratorium...and, to a man, wrote letters to the federal judge in New Orleans clarifying their position.

What leg is Obama going to stand on as he argues against this decision? The seven experts he chose for their expertise in the field recommended against the moratorium. Everyone knows what Ken Salazar did.

What happened in the Gulf is obviously bigger than "one accident" but that doesn't necessarily mean another accident is going to happen. BP had been cited countless times, apparently has the reputation for cutting corners, etc., but too many other companies have good records and, personally, I don't think it is fair to punish them and lose all these rigs to other countries.

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Permalink Reply by Two Dogs, Pirate on June 22, 2010 at 13:43

You said it Rosebud, I think to punish Shell et al for BP's mistakes is wrong.

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Permalink Reply by S.H.M. on June 22, 2010 at 12:39

So, for those that want to "Drill, baby, drill"...isn't an ounce of prevention worth a pound of cure? LOL. We have a few decades of cure ahead of us due to ONE accident. Not to mention the lives that were lost, which I won't mention, as nobody seems to give a...darn.

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Permalink Reply by Joseph J. Butler on June 22, 2010 at 13:42

I have a friend who used to call that rig DEEPWATER HORIZON his home away from home! He cosidered those people who died as part of his family! And you have the nerve to type LOL!

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Permalink Reply by essay on June 22, 2010 at 14:32

mr. maines has been reading the lefty blogs again, i think.

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Permalink Reply by S.H.M. on June 24, 2010 at 3:17

LOL. Maybe.

Actually, I do get the point of the resistance to the moratorium. And I am for drilling most anywhere. Geez, put one on my backyard. Put two, why don't ya? Please.

I am not opposed to drilling in National Parks. If it's there. Get it.

But caution is always warranted. And the environment should always be a consideration. I'd hate to give my daughter a dried out husk of a planet. We need serious alternatives and we all should be screaming to lessen our dependance on energy that ultimately comes from regimes that HATE us.

It's a fact, though, that the planet (and roaches) will be here long after we are gone.

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Permalink Reply by essay on June 25, 2010 at 11:47

we have common ground, and i appreciate the sentiments but the "alternatives" aren't ready for prime time yet, and we can't sustain the policy of throwing billions at a wall to see what sticks.

we've been "on the verge of a major breakthrough" in things like biofuels, solar, and hydrogen for decades now... i hate to say it but carter also flushed a ton of money on research, and give us the consolidated department of energy, which for an entity whose stated goal was to end dependence on foreign oil, has been a very expensive failure.

history may not always repeat itself, but it damn sure rhymes. there are scads of "green" companies that are going to fold the instant they are removed from the public dole. i actually kinda like windmills because of their synergy with gas, but i can't help but feel like we're regressing. reminds me of wooden shoes and tulip mania.

one thing's for sure, you're right about the planet outlasting humans, especially if we're so myopic as to think all of us actually have to stay here... the math for our long term population potential is pretty straight forward. i'm no holdren, i think the carrying capacity will ultimately be far larger than is currently accepted, but barring draconian population curtailments or an outright nuclear holocaust, we're going to literally eat this planet alive. go far enough out in time, and our future must literally lie among the stars in the heavens.

all of that to get to this point, that it's really easy to stumble on the rocks under your feet when you're craning your neck looking for pie in the sky.

p.s., somehow i can't help but think that if we fail as a species, the intelligent cockroaches that will surely evolve can't possibly screw things up as badly as we have.

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Permalink Reply by sesport on June 22, 2010 at 15:11

Our esteemed Governor isn't too happy at the moment with BP's handling of claims, either. Given that the Big Guys have admitted that they did a "copy & paste" of their emergency plans, do we really, REALLY want to invite the potential for more trouble (and don't talk to me about mathematical probabilities at this point ... geezzzzz, more than 80 days now)?

http://emergency.louisiana.gov/Releases/06222010-governor.html

"Governor Jindal said, “We are here at Gulf Stream Marina today and this is a recreational fishing marina that now sits empty because of the BP oil spill that caused the loss of recreational and commercial fishing activity that would usually be bustling at this time of year. This marina employs three people – and this is just one story of the many businesses here in Grand Isle that are struggling to deal with the very personal effects of this disaster on coastal Louisiana."

80P

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Permalink Reply by essay on June 22, 2010 at 16:06

never mind statistical probability, if you read the MSM it's almost like these guys would rather drill in 5k ft of water as a first choice... how many billions of far shallower barrels are off limits due to environmental handicapping?

the so-called "commission" is a joke, it's full of environmentalists... if we're to wait on these people to give the all-clear signal for gulf oil production, we'll be waiting a long, long time.

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Permalink Reply by sesport on June 22, 2010 at 16:36

Again, easy solution, IMHO. Idle the rigs but keep them in place. Re-train employees to do clean up on the company clock instead of begging for volunteers from far & wide to do it FOR FREE!!!

Not even going to touch the "blame game" here as far as government or industry is concerned. Suffice it to say that industry took on the task, and just like in my profession, industry takes responsibility. Taxpayers want to see results from the ones charged with the work. Again, IMHO, the history of how we got to this point goes "long & deep."

80)

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Permalink Reply by essay on June 22, 2010 at 17:02

i don't even know where to start with the first paragraph, just seems like you don't really understand the situation very well.

taxpayers also see the results of paying the salaries and bennies of the ones charged with overseeing the ones doing the work, who are also being told where and when they can operate by the aforementioned bureaucrats.

the real difference is, at least we get something tangibly useful out of the energy companies.

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Permalink Reply by sesport on June 22, 2010 at 23:15

re. first paragraph - Please elaborate on what you can't divine.

Here's what I understand. Idle the rigs and, as Bird Dawg says, they go where they get paid. Fine, let the companies pay to keep the ones idled in place.

Idle the rigs, and employees get laid off. Fine, keep the employees on the clock and send them to go help clean up efforts.

As for the second paragraph, I did say government AND industry. You seem to want to ignore the fact that industry took advantage of lax oversight (hmmmm, wonder who pushed for that?) to push the envelope. The companies are being told "where and when" because the government has a responsibility to care for & manage PUBLIC lands and waters. If they don't exercise caution ... well ...

We're still getting something "tangibly useful" out of the energy companies, the moratorium doesn't affect all rigs. Seems we're also getting something "tangibly useful" out of gov employees now, too, as we pay them to resolve this mess. Or perhaps they should just stand aside and allow the industries to take charge of it all? Yeah, how's that working so far in plugging the gusher?

80)

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