Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Spring Branch,mineral owner on January 19, 2009 at 4:10

Barbara, why aren't you leased, surely attempts have been made to lease you?? Who is doing the survey, and for whom?

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Permalink Reply by Barbara on January 19, 2009 at 5:00

Not leased because: A. I hired attorney (*&%$#) in May '08 who applied too many stipulations in lease and wasted a lot of time. B. One company was interested at $17,500 but had a very bad lease agreement (based on knowledge gained by working with attorney (*&%$#). C. Market crashed. Now I'm on my own trying to find someone to lease it. I am meeting with the surveyers this evening and was trying to get a general feel for what to do beforehand.

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Permalink Reply by Spring Branch,mineral owner on January 19, 2009 at 6:38

My 80 acres on HWY 789 in Caddo Parish recently was surveyed. Dawson Geophysical did the survey . Had one guy on 4 wheeler with blue and white survey tape hanging tape to mark access roads, logging roads, etc. Basically anything that will make it easier to get around on the property. Second group of about 5 or 6 guys came a few days later with GPS & orange and white survey tape marking the spots for the actual detonations Also orange stakes which were driven into the ground. The second group was on foot and walked in from nearest road. Only damage of any kind so far was hacking brush and small saplings for "line of sight" to the different markers. I want to emphasize that they have not done the actual seismic shoot yet, so I can't comment on how that will go. I agreed to $25 an acre for the seismic and I have not yet been paid. I assume they will "before" they do the actual shoot. Are you in NW DeSoto Parish, Barbara? If so it might part of the same seismic survey.

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Permalink Reply by Barbara on January 19, 2009 at 7:05

I'm in Section 8, T11, R11. It's called Dolet Hills which is about 7 mi. south of Mansfield on Hwy. 175 then East about 3 mi.

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Permalink Reply by Dion Warr, CPL on January 19, 2009 at 7:24

Barbara:

Have you already signed a lignite lease with the mining company? What surface, exploration and/or mineral rights does that agreement cover?

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Permalink Reply by Barbara on January 19, 2009 at 10:27

Original lease signed in 1979 for coal/lignite only. It includes a surface lease and actual mining operations will begin within the next couple of months.

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Permalink Reply by Dion Warr, CPL on January 19, 2009 at 12:59

The reason that I ask is that if the lignite lease was signed prior to the seismic permit, you may want to have the no warranty clause, not even for return of monies paid provision added to your permit, for sure. That way, if the terms of the lignite agreement conflict with the planned seismic operations, you are protected (as without a warranty, you are not liable for return of monies even if you don't have the rights to allow the seismic company to drill shot holes, for example).

On the whole, this should not matter much, as you are probably being contacted as a 'surface owner', but you wouldn't want the seismic outfit to come back on you demanding their money back for 'thus and such' reason.

If you are in the HS fairway (which you most assuredly should be, there are units around you in all directions), granting the seismic permit is not going to destroy your mineral lease prospects, as the deposition of the HS appears to be more or less uniform over large areas. In fact, the 3-D might resolve some other geologic strata of interest (as well as traps, etc.) underlying your property that might have gone unnoticed.

The fears expressed by CK were those expressed by l/o and m/o fearful of the 3-D seismic movement starting in the 90s, since it was purported (if not known) that 3-D has a much better ability to resolve 'good spots' from 'bad spots' or 'not so good spots'. Many were afraid that bad returns on 3-D would condemn their area from further leasing activity. The fact that 3-D has been shot over many of the viable or prospective producing areas of the state, in addition to the fact that exploration continued in virtually all of those areas, tended to refute this supposition, with exceptions to the rule being rather uncommon. In general, 3-D has increased the success rates in terms of wells completed and productive versus total wells drilled. Moreover, 3-D has stimulated a new wave of drilling and production based upon better resolution of geologic subsurface anomalies (subtle traps, etc.), some of which would not have been explored at all pre 3-D.

The truth is that in more recent, traditional (non-resource) plays, many of the O&G companies drilling wells are going to either (1) want 3-D seismic shot before they drill, (2) have a reservoir of knowledge derived from either 2-D or 3-D seismic shot in the past, or (3) are drilling in your area based upon well information from your section or in the immediate vicinity. So the idea at this point in time that you will somehow "keep leasing alive" as to your acreage if you do not allow 3-D seismic testing is pretty much bunk, IMO.

Certainly, have your seismic agreement (1) protect your surface and access rights, (2) be comprehensive as far as remuneration on damages, (3) provide for sufficent notice prior to entry on your property, if warranted, (4) list methods of damage assessment as to valuable crops and standing timber, (5) address restoration issues as warranted and specific to your land and land use. You could press to receive a copy of your seismic data for your records, but at 60 acres, this request probably would not be honored (agreed to) by the grantee.

There are other threads on the site which go into greater depth as to what to include in a negotiation on seismic rights. Please read up on those, FYI.

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Permalink Reply by CaddoKid on January 19, 2009 at 10:38

Barbara, I wouldn't worry yet about not being leased. Your 60 will be an important sized piece in a typical 640 acre unit, and the O&Gs will likely need your tract under contract to drill in the unit. Check your mining lease to make sure there's no restrictive covenant with them that would prevent you from use of your surface for other purposes. You might want to ask the (*&%$#) attorney to review that lease.

I leased before my seismic shoot, which will be happening about now. My (*&%$#) attorney beefed up the permit language for specific compensation for trees removed, emphasized bank and erosion protection for the spring and creek on my place, and required compacted soils by heavy equipment to be mitigated to original condition, important to me for forestry considerations. The seismic outfit had no problems with the additional measures. As KB once pointed out to me, you can require more than boilerplate "industry standards" in the reparations language of the permit you would sign. $25/acre is standard, some have done a little better. Spring Branch: I think it's standard to be compensated for seismic after the work is completed, though that may be negotiable.

However, it's hard for me to see any advantage for you to allow seismic before being leased, Barbara, unless they just happen to find attractive reflection waves post-seismic. As you point out, they might come to the conclusion that your tract is unspectacular, i.e., the shale is very deep, very thin, etc (they may actually know the likely conditions already). I'd be curious as to the opinions of other experienced ROs on this question. You might try telling the seismic folks you want to enter lease negotiations before exploration, but with ga$ so low now, you might not expect to receive the $17.5K offer. Patience may be the order of the day.
CK

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Permalink Reply by olddog573 on January 19, 2009 at 12:58

Barbara,
Barbara,

I am surprised that the mine is gonna let people come in for the survey. From the township map, looks like your property is right near where they are currently mining in section 9. We had a guy break his leg on our lease, (which is inside the mine but in a section that has been released back to the land owner), and the mine wouldn't let the ambulance go through the main gate at evelyn which was 3 miles away from the stranded individual. The ambulance had to go around to Double Churches to get to the stranded individual. I might add that the individual had two bones sticking out of his leg and almost bled to death and they still refused access. With that being said, I again am surprised they are allowing access for surveying so I wish you good luck.

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Permalink Reply by Robert G. Oliver on February 3, 2009 at 10:02

If you grant the company the right to survey across your land. Before they will come across the property they will have to do the title to determine what the status of the minerals are and contact the correct holders of any rights. If I was you I would ask for a copy of the release from the mining company . Ask for and demand a shot point plat so you can how close the shot points will be to any bulildings are wells. The Companies insurance will require that they stay at lest 1/4 mile away from the buildings. If you need any more information , email me

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