Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Steve P on December 7, 2011 at 14:31

fascinating article.  Not mentioned was the lack of available water in the West to support more extensive drilling programs.  While I am all for a careful review and elimination of unnecessary regulations, it is too often just a whipping boy because it is an easy target.

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Permalink Reply by Hopeful About Natural Gas on December 7, 2011 at 16:55

At least this fellow does his homework.  It's a good, well written article, although it comes down on the side of limiting drilling.

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He published a couple of interesting maps about gas supplies and shale distribution.  I think these are relatively new(er) and the amount of shale gas in the US is stunning.

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http://wyofile.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/independence_graph_1.jpg

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http://wyofile.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/independence_graph_3.jpg

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Here is his name - longtime reporter in Wyoming on energy issues.  The site has a whole section of his past writings. I wish all reporters were this good and interested in their topics even if I don't agree with every word they write.

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— Dustin Bleizeffer, WyoFile editor-in-chief, has covered Wyoming’s energy industry for 13 years.

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DOES ANYONE KNOW WHY MY POSTS DO NOT SHOW PARAGRAPHS???  I HAD TO GO BACK AND PUT IN PERIODS TO MAKE SPACES BETWEEN PARAGRAPHS!  help!!!

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Permalink Reply by DrWAVeSport Cd1 on December 8, 2011 at 7:54

HANG,

Great info.  Thanks for the background searches.  Will invite Mr. Bleizeffer to become a GHS member.

A Great GHS Holiday Season to the GHS member with the greatest GHS moniker. (IMO) (LOL)

DrWAVeSport Cd1 12/8/2011 

 

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Permalink Reply by baddog on December 8, 2011 at 4:32

The biggest issue I have with the article is that the writer simply dismisses the significant increase in natural gas useage possible for transporation due to cost developing distribution.  If a comparison was done on the cost to quickly increase the NG filling stations alongside/adjoining many existing service stations versus 1) the savings in price of NG versus gasoline and 2) the amount of money staying in the USA versus sent oversee ($400,000,000,000+ per year).  The writer also does not acknowledge that there is already much of the pipelines in place.  The primary cost is installation of the filling station themselves.  I believe the conversion would be "paid" for in savings within 5 years - a very quick payback considering subsidies for "green" energy have been around for about 20 years and are uneconomical without ongoing government subsidies.   We will see the acceptance of bi-fuel vehicles that will start to be introduced to the market in late 2012 (Chevy Silverado and F-250), which I believe will become the model (bi-fuel) for the transition to NG as the primary USA transportation fuel within 10-15 years.  The benefits to the US economy will be HUGE.   

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Permalink Reply by The_Baron on December 8, 2011 at 4:36

I don't think there is any real cost in converting. Existing stations could add a few nat gas "pumps" to there already existing equipment.  Its hard to justify the expense when there is no demand though. If you could get a few long haul fleets to adopt nat gas (through generous subsidies) the large chain truck stops would add nat gas to accomadate.

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Permalink Reply by P.G. on December 8, 2011 at 5:57

Wasn't there a time when diesel was only available at truck stops?

Looks at it's availability now...

Seems like converting the truck fleets would be the wise way to generate demand for private autos just like it was for private diesel fueled vehicles..

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Permalink Reply by DrWAVeSport Cd1 on December 8, 2011 at 7:41

P.G.

A GHS "Touche'" to you! 

CNG or GTL will work and is U.S. Future.   The debate, the demand, the dollars are mere stumbling blocks.   I say mere stumbling blocks because "life" changed with the world-wide declaration and support that shale deposits could/would sustain World energy needs for 100 plus years.   WE HAVE THE ANSWER to The Question of The Century:  How can the WORLD sustain its Energy Appetite for the Future?    Nat Gas!

Most often problem solving is dedicated to finding the end result/answer to the problem.  The World's Future Energy Source answer has now been found.  NG  That question now has been definitely answered, not just for U.S., but for any WORLD Energy Crises.  IMO

Therefore, the question has been answered, thus the mechanics (infrastructure) are mere stumbling blocks.

When the U.S. and NASA said YES, WE WILL GO TO THE MOON...It was only the "mechanical" stumbling blocks that had to be removed... then, the race was on!

When the U.S. says YES, Natural Gas WILL MAKE U.S. ENERGY INDEPENDENT...It will only be the "mechanical" stumbling blocks that have to be removed...  then, the race will be on!

Too bad U.S. DOESN'T SUPPORT ITS OWN ENERGY INDEPENDENCE with the Same Support IT Supports NASA Projects!  (IMO only)  (BILLIONS $$$$$)

Thanks P.G.  Your insights and logical look at the World are always "food for thought" for me.

Happy Holidays and My Best to you and yours for a great GHS 2012.

DrWAVeSport Cd1 12/8/2011

 

 

 

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Permalink Reply by Hopeful About Natural Gas on December 8, 2011 at 10:15

Yep, P.G is right. There was a time in the dim, distant past of 25+ years ago when diesal was only sold at truck stops.  I remember people gripping about having to drive to Kelly's Truck Stop in Greenwood (which now has a new name, TA??))

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Permalink Reply by baddog on December 8, 2011 at 11:16

I hear that 10-12 existing local service stations will add natural gas pumps within 12-18 months.  Requires 1/4 to 1/2 acre adjoining existing service station (at $8/sf for land, thats about $100,000) if station doesn't already own the land.  Plus the installed equipment cost is reportedly about $400,000 to $600,00.

It's the chicken and egg question - are you going to buy a vehicle you can't conveniently fill up???  Are you going to spend $500,000+/- if you  don't have customers yet???

That is why it will be a much slower transition to get to a LARGE number of vehicles running on NG versus having a number of stations installed just before a number of bi-fuel vehicles hit the market, with tax breaks to install the equipment for limited time, say 3 years.

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Permalink Reply by P.G. on December 8, 2011 at 11:29

If NG fuel was reasonably available...probably be a no brainer what folks would trade for next time with the difference in fuel prices....even the savings for commercial trucks would be substantial without any government incentives

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Permalink Reply by jffree1 on December 9, 2011 at 1:38

P.G., if you looked at the CNG fueling station (locator) map back in 2009 it seemed impossible that we could travel coast to coast on CNG.  Most of the public stations were in Cal. with a few on the East Coast (if I remember correctly).

Now? It's pretty amazing just how many stations there are (public & private).

http://www.cngnow.com/stations/Pages/information.aspx

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Permalink Reply by P.G. on December 9, 2011 at 9:04

Got to keep in mind one can't go any further than what a half a tank will take them unless they are traveling to another refueling station...

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