Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Martin on May 25, 2013 at 8:19

LN --

   You might wish to consult with a good O&G lawyer. May I recommend Mr, Summers of Davidson, Jones & Summers in Shreveport?  Mr. Summers negotiated several leases for me with Chesapeake. 

Your situation sounds complex, to say the least. Please keep us posted as to progress.

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Permalink Reply by LN on May 25, 2013 at 14:44

This is just the surface of the all of the proof we have that cannot be refuted.  One thing that I learned in college that was drilled in my head, document everything!  :-)

Martin, I do thank you for your suggestion, but I already have an attorney.

I will keep everyone posted as I am aware that my situation will help others to legally go after what belongs to them.

Again, thanks Martin.

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Permalink Reply by ELLIS HUGH on May 28, 2013 at 3:09

Sounds like there a few title issues that need to be sorted out.

Just because a will is deemed "false", doesn't necessarily mean the legatees aren't entitled to inherit - the property would be distributed via intestate succession.  Also, the will could have only been associated a portion of the mineral rights (usually see this associated with community property vs separate property arguments).  

Additionally, an Oil and Gas Company sometimes decides to take the option of leasing EVERYBODY who may have a claim to the property, then, let the potential owners seek civil action and let the courts decide who is the current owner(s).  Property disputes are VERY common, especially in cases of 'old family land' that has been willed and inherited for many generations. 

Depending on the amount of acreage (and interest) involved.  CHK may make their 'best attempt' at leasing your interest, then move on.  By the way, they filed your birth certificate & mother's death certificate to help clarify ownership of the lands - they wouldn't have done that if they wanted to muddy the water.  Good Luck getting this sorted out.

-EH

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Permalink Reply by LN on May 28, 2013 at 4:27

EH, thank you for your response.

I would have no problem with some of the things that you stated.  However, one of our issues among many, is that we have  information from THEIR employees that will PROVE that this O&G Company told us (and others), that these fok were submitting fraudulent documents to them.  That's why they wouldn't accept their information. The O&G Company validated that is "will" was false.  But, one year later, after I would not sign the LA, they decided to accept the same fraudulent "will" and entered into a LA with these same folk.  And as if that's not bad enough,  these folk with that they entered the LA with are not even related to us!

Is it the norm for O&G Companies to information that they have proven to be false and proceed to use the same information to enter into a LA?  Is this how this business operates?  We're just trying to understand how it goes.

 

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Permalink Reply by ELLIS HUGH on May 28, 2013 at 6:02

LN - It depends on the nature of the fraudulent documents and who deemed them to be fraudulent.  I can't attest how the "business operates", but as a 9-year landman, the clients I represented always wanted to identify the rightful owners of a tract to acquire an OGML and/or pay royalties under an OGML.  Title issues get messy. People get messy. I have bought hundreds of 'protective leases' (leases bought from 'possible' owners).  

Ultimately, it is the duty and responsibility of the land/mineral owner to know what they own.  If you feel you have a rightful claim to YOUR land. Hire an attorney and clean up the title.  Put evidence of legal record in the county courthouse proving your claim.  File suit against anyone engaging in fraudulent activities.  You protect your rights - dont count on a broker or oil and gas company to do so.  

Just my thoughts.

-EH

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Permalink Reply by Aubrey C. Sanders, Jr. on May 28, 2013 at 6:54

VERY GOOD ADVICE, EH

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Permalink Reply by LN on May 28, 2013 at 10:22

Hi Ellis Hugh, you are quite knowledgeable.  Do you work for an oil & gas company?

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Permalink Reply by Andrew on June 14, 2013 at 18:02

LN,

I wanted to address your question "How can this O & G Co. say that they entered into the LA unaware that these folk were dishonest when it can be proven otherwise?" 

A company can take a lease and make payments to anyone, even if they know with 100% certainty that they are not the mineral owner. Though a waste of money for the company, the mineral owner isn't harmed by a lease from a non-owner in and of itself (except to the extent that recording the lease creates a title cloud that can be removed). 

Why would a company do this? Because they have identified possibly competing claims to ownership of the minerals that would require litigation to be resolved. Rather than waiting for a court ruling on who the correct mineral owners are, the company enters into a lease with all the parties they identify as having a potential claim. This is sanctioned by Mineral Code Article 121:

§ 121. Right of lessee to lease from adverse claimants

"A mineral lessee may take leases from persons claiming the leased land or mineral rights or interests therein adversely to his lessor."

I recognize that your situation is not one where they paid the other parties AND you, but instead leased from them INSTEAD of you. However, that doesn't change the fact that the company is free to pay whatever non-owners (i.e. waste money) they choose. Likewise, they are not legally to take a lease from the actual owners (or anyone for that matter).

As I see it, the real owner of the minerals in this situation has three claims. First, they can file suit against the strangers who claim ownership to the true owner can be determined by a court and clouds to her title can be removed. In that same vein, a lease from a non-owner is recorded, the true owner can sue the parties to that lease to have it removed from the records. Finally, if the minerals are under a producing well or in a producing unit, and the true owner is unleased, they can sue the company operating the well if they are not paid their proportionate share of production after well payout. 

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Permalink Reply by Rozzy on May 27, 2013 at 17:48

I worked with Red River they are legit. They worked with me to help finalize my lease agreement with Petrohawk. The guy I worked with seemed nice and I never had issues contacting the gentleman while negotiating a price for leasing. Although Petrohawk never drilled on my land, I would use Red River again.

Hope this helps.

Roz

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Permalink Reply by LN on May 28, 2013 at 4:31

Thank you Roz for your input.

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Permalink Reply by Steve P on June 15, 2013 at 17:06

Andrew has it right.  If you own the interest in the land, it is your responsibility to take appropriate actions to establish that interest in the public records of the parish/county where the property is located.   If Red River Land Company (which I know nothing about) is merely the agent of the producer charged with taking leases and trying to cure or clear up the title, then they owe, for all practical purposes, nothing to you. 

Just an observation - my personal opinion - if I had an unproven title or claim to a mineral interest, and someone showed up at my door and offered me a lease and the willingness to work with me, I think I would be reluctant to "bite the hand that feeds me."  It appears that's what you did - and now you are faulting them for their response.

Again - if you have a claim to the property, it is up to you to prove up your claim and stop expecting others to do it for you.

 

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